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Home  /  Forum  /  Koffiekamer  /  10% Drop in Dow Jones en bounce erna.. !

Koffiekamer« Terug naar discussie overzicht

10% Drop in Dow Jones en bounce erna.. !

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144 Posts
Pagina: «« 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 8 »» | Laatste | Omlaag ↓
  7. [verwijderd] 7 mei 2010 12:51
    quote:

    crackedtooth schreef:

    15 minuten chart nog duidelijker in hoe korte tijd down en weer up

    Puur hedge fund algoritme selling (triggered automatisch verkopen). Sneeuwbaleffect en niet zozeer particuliren.

    15min Dow Jones chart
    Compumters die handelaren gaan de hele economie nog eesn kapot maken en ons er dus bij. De domheid van de mens neemt astronomische vormen aan, puur door winstbejag n luiheid. Mensnen moeten aandelen verhandelen die hebben gevoel en inzicht computers kunnen helemaal NIETS berkenen vooruit en al helemaal niet over politieke stress nadenken. Kortom waardelooos. :)
  9. [verwijderd] 7 mei 2010 15:05
    quote:

    crackedtooth schreef:

    Puur hedge fund algoritme selling (triggered automatisch verkopen). Sneeuwbaleffect en niet zozeer particuliren.
    Hoe verklaar je dan dat honderden fondsen inclusief valuta's bijna tegelijk in een vrije val raakten?
    Ik heb op meerdere plekken gelezen dat de bid kant voor alles ineens leeg was. Dat kan niet door alg. trading worden verklaard.
  10. [verwijderd] 7 mei 2010 15:42
    quote:

    De AEX Belegger schreef:

    [quote=crackedtooth]
    Puur hedge fund algoritme selling (triggered automatisch verkopen). Sneeuwbaleffect en niet zozeer particuliren.
    [/quote]

    Hoe verklaar je dan dat honderden fondsen inclusief valuta's bijna tegelijk in een vrije val raakten?
    Ik heb op meerdere plekken gelezen dat de bid kant voor alles ineens leeg was. Dat kan niet door alg. trading worden verklaard.
    Kom op YANKS (JAN KEES(en) hollands namen verbasterd tot het engelse woord YAN KEES wat eigenlijk staat voor de bewoners van Nieuw Holland, nieuw amsterdam ten tijde van de pelgrimperiode) voor degene die zijn eigen cultuurhistorie nog niet kent....helpt ons! Groen wil ik zien en dat zie ik.:)
  11. [verwijderd] 7 mei 2010 19:13

    The contrarian: Was it a Cyber Attack?

    Friday, 07 May 2010 15:11


    For a little under 30 minutes today, the New York Stock Exchange became the center of the Twilight Zone.

    During that period, roughly between 2:28 PM and 3:00 PM EDST, the Dow Jones Industrial Average plunged hundreds of points, paused briefly - (down 998 points, just above the trading-suspension level) - and then roared back. It ended the day down 347.80, but the real story is the mystery that swirls around those 28-or-so minutes.

    For example, in just four minutes, Proctor & Gamble fell from 62.68 to 53.99, but that was nothing. One of the largest utilities in the world, Exelon Corp., a company worth around $30 billion, saw its stock drop to zero before gaining back most of its loss. The “flash crash” similarly took several other companies briefly down to the zero level. Curiously, one stock ran away in the other direction. Sotheby’s went from 34.61 to 100,000 before settling at $33.

    Initially, the villain was said to be computer trading, then the wild gyrations were blamed on a typo in a Citigroup order. Citi, however, said it couldn’t confirm that. The NYSE said it was the electronic trading and Senator Ted Kaufman (D-Del.) told CNN it could have been caused by any one of twenty possible reasons. The lawmaker said that the situation had been watched closely by Congress and there was grave concern that no one knew how it happened.

    The “twenty reasons” cited by Senator Kaufman may have included a cyber attack on the financial markets as one possibility. Such an act has been recognized as a realistic threat for some time now. Computer hacking by sovereign nations has been described as the WMD for the very near future.

    news.hostexploit.com/cyberwar-news/37...
  12. [verwijderd] 7 mei 2010 20:27
    Computers, Not Human Error, Likely Caused Market Meltdown

    Buzz up! 0 Print..On Friday May 7, 2010, 12:04 pm EDT
    Computerized sell programs triggered by global events-rather than trader error or "fat finger"-appear to have caused Thursday's unprecedented market swing, according market pros who are reconstructing the nearly 1,000-point stock selloff.

    These experts think the intensely accelerated electronic trading was sparked by the Greek debt crisis and other events and not a trader who typed a "b" for billion instead of "m" for million in executing a trade on Thursday.

    Friday's intensified selloff seemed only to confirm that investors are afraid of what lies ahead and are wary of the stock market.

    "It wasn't a fat finger," said Dave Lutz, managing director of trading at Stifel Nicolaus in Baltimore. "The markets became unglued...Most of it was centered on the fact that currency markets affected the equity markets."

    Not everyone is so sure. Authorities are probing the trading activity and looking to see whether a human mistake or manipulation was at play.

    But Lutz said his firm was advising clients to sell Friday as evidence mounts of tightening in global credit markets. He considered the market behavior Thursday, though, as "a one-off event" as far as such a dramatic drop goes but warned that the times ahead will be rocky.

    The movements of the Japanese yen were being closely tracked yesterday, as were the continued weakening of the euro as events unfolded in Greece. The strength of the US dollar-particularly against the yen-also caught attention as flight-to-safety trades increased.

    While the exact origin of the selloff may not be known for weeks, the staggering selloff in the Dow came as Greeks stormed the streets in protest against the parliament's acquiescence to austerity demands from the European Union.

    Market sources say the confluence of events likely triggered electronic selling programs. As that selling commenced, the human element of the markets quickly evaporated and computerized trading programs wantonly sold stocks at whatever price was available, creating a feeding frenzy.

    "A lot of these (electronic trading) models become very sensitive when volatility is high," said Aaron Gurwitz, managing director of research, economics and strategy at Barclays Wealth in New York. "It's possible that a lot of these models got to a point where they got strong reduce-risk signals, that things are not working right."

    "In that context," he continued, "even a small glitch, a slightly overweight finger rather than a fat finger, could have triggered a lot of the things that happened....A lot of very substantial traders become very sensitive. There's not that much difference among these models. We've seen this can be a source of potential systemic risk that really does need to be investigated."

    More specifically, though, market experts saw the European debt crisis as a major trigger for the selloff. The EU's currency, according to views of hedge fund manager Dennis Gartman and others, is under threat of ultimately failing.

    Boris Schlossberg, of GFT Forex, also doubted trader error as the true root of the selloff and asserted that currency markets played a far greater role.

    "The currency market was the leader in this whole calamity yesterday because yen is a critical risk-funding currency," Schlossberg said in a CNBC interview. "When it starts to collapse and when there is a lot of (algorithms) that are correlated to the Dow Jones, they started selling S&Ps."

    Heads of both the Nasdaq and New York Stock Exchange reported Friday no significant discrepancies in trading activity and defended the operations of their exchanges.

    Nasdaq CEO Robert Greifeld echoed sentiment that the market can tumble very quickly when intense fear sets in.

    "It's equivalent to what happened back in the day with telephone markets where traders didn't answer the telephone to incoming orders. So we had a situation where the markets soar, the primary market is not responding and it has a disproportionate impact to the psyche of the market," he said in a CNBC interview.

    Some traders were hoping to settle back in and put Thursday's events behind them.

    "Euro-yen actually reached levels from Sept. 11," Leon Yohai, CEO of currency trading platform ZuluTrade said in an interview from Greece. "The crisis has passed but everybody knows that Europe is not as strong as it used to be."

    The results of regulatory probes into Thursday events will be anxiously awaited.

    "These guys (regulators) have to take a few weeks to look at this," said Yousef Abbasi, financial desk analyst at Execution Noble in New York. "People understand there was a glitch of some sort and we just have to move on."

    finance.yahoo.com/news/Computers-Not-...
  16. [verwijderd] 11 mei 2010 17:57
    House Panel to Hold Stock Market InquiryThe House Finance Services subcommittee will hold a hearing Tuesday to investigate why the Dow Jones Industrial Average plunged nearly 1,000 points in less than a half hour Thursday, before making a quick recovery. By Lucas Mearian on Fri, May 07, 2010

    Computerworld — The House Financial Services Committee today said its securities subcommittee plans to hold a hearing next week to examine the operational issues surrounding the U.S. stock market plunge Thursday.
    Sharp Stock Market Drop Likely Human, Computer Error
    The Dow Jones Industrial Average dropped nearly 1,000 points in a half hour Thursday before bouncing back to within 348 points of the day's opening. Industry sources said the precipitous drop was likely due to both human error that was exacerbated by high-speed trading platforms rolled out over the past decade.
    The Dow fell to 9,867 points from its previous day's close of 10,868 before rebounding to 10,464 points by the close of the market Thursday. Industry experts said it was obvious that there was some sort of "algorithmic error" in the computerized trading systems that caused the pricing in the markets to collapse.
    For example, TD Ameritrade (AMTD) said one of its client's stock price orders started at $60 and dropped to 11 cents before rebounding. In another example, The Wall Street Journal 's MarketBeat blog reported Accenture's stock price plummeted from more than $40 at 2:47 p.m. to a penny at 2:48 p.m.
    The House Financial Services' securities subcommittee plans to hold a hearing at 3 p.m. Tuesday to address the causes of the dramatic drop in the Dow before it recovered.
    House subcommittee Chairman Paul Kanjorski, (D-Penn.), said in a statement that Thursday's stock market seemed "just as volatile as it did in the fall of 2008."
    "Reports have surfaced that much of this movement was potentially as a result of a computer glitch," Kanjorski said. "We cannot allow a technological error to spook the markets and cause panic. This is unacceptable. In this day and age and with the use of such complex technology, we should be able to make sure that our financial markets are effectively monitored and investors are protected."
    Kanjorski also called on the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission to investigate the problem.
    Earlier this year, the SEC sent a letter to brokerage houses saying it was conducting a "broad review" of the equity market structure and asking them for comments. The review would include an evaluation of equity market structure performance in recent years and an assessment of whether market structure rules have kept pace with, among other things, trading technology.
    The SEC asked for comment on a wide range of market structure issues, including high frequency trading, order routing, market data linkages, and undisplayed, or "dark," liquidity.
    "The Commission intends to use the public's comments to help determine whether regulatory initiatives to improve the current equity market structure are needed and, if so, the specific nature of such initiatives," the letter stated.
    In 2005, the New York Stock Exchange dropped its manual system where floor traders shouted out buy and sell orders and adopted hand-held computers .
    Read more about financial services in Computerworld's Financial Services Knowledge Center.
    © 2010 Computerworld Inc.

    www.cio.com/article/593047/House_...
  18. [verwijderd] 15 mei 2010 23:47
    Alles op een rijtje:

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_6,_2010_Flash_Crash

    Wat kun je hieruit nu concluderen? Het feit dat er nog steeds geen officiele verklaring is gekomen is nogal opmerkelijk. Dat het in de media geen aandacht krijgt wat het verdient lijkt alsof de machtige mannen geen paniek willen veroorzaken. Het gaat hier niet alleen om een verdamping van een onvoorstelbaar bedrag in enkele seconden, maar om het feit dat in een oogwenk het hele financiele systeem aan het wankelen kan worden gebracht! De media gooide het direkt op een "fat finger". Denk even na!

    Natuurlijk is er een oorzaak aan te wijzen en dat zal ook al lang bekend zijn. Als dat niet zo is, dan zijn we overgeleverd aan de willekeur van een systeem dat we niet kennen. Dat is natuurlijk absoluut ondenkbaar! Gaat u eens na wat de belangen zijn. Men kan de historie van orders precies uitpluizen. Logboeken analyseren en het is bekend. Het kan niet zo zijn dat dat zolang duurt.

    Er zijn dingen die we niet mogen weten...
  19. [verwijderd] 15 mei 2010 23:52
    quote:

    ester schreef:

    Alles op een rijtje:

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_6,_2010_Flash_Crash

    Wat kun je hieruit nu concluderen? Het feit dat er nog steeds geen officiele verklaring is gekomen is nogal opmerkelijk. Dat het in de media geen aandacht krijgt wat het verdient lijkt alsof de machtige mannen geen paniek willen veroorzaken. Het gaat hier niet alleen om een verdamping van een onvoorstelbaar bedrag in enkele seconden, maar om het feit dat in een oogwenk het hele financiele systeem aan het wankelen kan worden gebracht! De media gooide het direkt op een "fat finger". Denk even na!

    Natuurlijk is er een oorzaak aan te wijzen en dat zal ook al lang bekend zijn. Als dat niet zo is, dan zijn we overgeleverd aan de willekeur van een systeem dat we niet kennen. Dat is natuurlijk absoluut ondenkbaar! Gaat u eens na wat de belangen zijn. Men kan de historie van orders precies uitpluizen. Logboeken analyseren en het is bekend. Het kan niet zo zijn dat dat zolang duurt.

    Er zijn dingen die we niet mogen weten...
    Klopt als een bus.
    Er zijn heel veel dingen wat mensen niet weten.
    Dat wordt achter gesloten deuren besproken.
    En daar komt niemand.
    Geen media geen burger geen rijk persoon.
    Geen onbevoegd persoon.
    Dan komen alleen de hoofdbank basen bij elkaar.
    En dan overleggen ze in top geheim wat ze gaan doen.
    En ze weten pressies hoe ze het spelletje moeten spelen.
    En daarna gaan ze toneel spelen.
144 Posts
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